In honor of Hillary’s schoolmarm harangue against the alt-right today, I’ll jot down a few of my thoughts on the idea of White Nationalism (as a principle and as it would work in practice).
First, a word on vanilla (heh) nationalism.
Nationalism ultimately distills to racial nationalism, though the latter isn’t required to prompt the former (or to sustain it for a while). A polyglot, Babelized citizenry corrodes nationalist principles and practices. A multicultural nationalism is an oxymoron over a long enough timeline. This is self-evident once we take it as a given that culture (aka nation) is inherited from the genetic legacy of its people.
So in principle, White Nationalism is effectively a synonym for garden-variety nationalism, because a numerical onslaught of nonWhites would irretrievably alter the characteristics of a White-majority nation that followed a theoretically race-blind nationalist ideology (similar to Steve Sailer’s Citizenism).
In practice, though, avowed White Nationalism is a non-starter. Whites aren’t a monolith. Italy looks and operates differently than England which looks and operates differently than Ukraine. There are four primary continental scale races — White, asian, amerind, black — and a nationalism ideology that attempted to place those races under an all-encompassing umbrella term would be viciously mocked and rebuked by popular revolt. There can be no Black Nationalism or Asian Nationalism or Amerind Nationalism. Try telling a Mexican he’s indistinguishable from an El Salvadoran.
Likewise, a White Nationalism movement will fail.
Although I will say this in contradiction: If White Nationalism can work anywhere, it’s most likely to find purchase in a Euro-mixed nation like America, and at a point when American Whites fall below 50% of the total population. (Spot the irony.)
I’ll have more to say on this subject in future posts, but for now my conclusion is to leave White Nationalism alone in favor of regular Nationalism. The White part will work itself out organically as the nation becomes less globalist and more nationalist.
* I can say that, overall, CH is correct, when one lumps all Whites together. I really do not favor the term, “White Nationalism”. The problem with White Nationalism is that, even if you remove the non-Whites from your midst, you can still end up with a high likelihood of nasty little fights like WWI and WWII, where nationalistic Whites (choosing their nations over the commonality that should have bound them together) decided to slaughter each other.
Instead, I prefer the term “Racially Conscious Whites”, or some related term, to point out our common genes and culture, instead of the differences that separate us due to indiscriminate boundary lines on some map.
As such, when I meet racially proud White brothers and sisters, anywhere in the world, who are not blinded, or held back, by national boundaries, I have more in common with them than the middle-of-the-road White neighbors on my street.
Nationalism made these White brothers fight each other (and likely die). Let’s not raise flags blindly.
* Is obvious that all whites are not equal. More in behavior than in intelligence, (except germans/north italians) very creative people luckily I have fresh blood of both.
Nationalism can’t back to Europe. Not only the 2 WWs but a lot of big pre world wars conflicts. I guess what you don’t like from other whites because is the same I don’t like:
Spaniards: collectivism/ difficulties with abstract thought
Italians: corrupt,low law abiding
EE: extremely violent/collectivism
Irish: don’t know, anti individualism?
Scots : ?
Let me tell now what the rest europeans don’t like of you:
Hardcore capitalism, loser/winner mindset and the most important puritan moral collectivism/too much rule abiding far away from the logical point.
* It is worse than you describe.
If a black man abandons Christianity for Islam, he is praised.
If a black man associates with the Black Panthers, Nation of Islam, or NAACP, he may be promoted for his community participation.
If a white man, a descendent of a Confederate soldier, joins Sons of the Confederacy, he may be fired for hate speech.
* Respectfully, what CH is missing is that, what is unique about America, is it was the first nation or even first political organization of people NOT built on race or ethnicity, but on an ideal. Alt-Right/ethno-racial nationalism is based on European political thinking. The latter is a way of thinking that goes back to the beginning of Human history. America made a break from this. It showed that it was possible, even ideal.
Leftism, another European ideological import, exploits ethnic and racial groups for it’s benefit, seeking to be in power. The Alt-Right, being an ethno-racial ideology also, reacts to such, and fights back, also seeking to be in power. Both however are ethno-racial based, even more so the latter however.
America doesn’t deny the influences of bio-mechanics and race and ethnicity. It developed a new way to organize and benefit from such influences. We need Constitutionalism more than we need White Nationalism. The latter is just a European leftist ideology based on race, ethnicity and bio-mechanics. It’s a watered down Nazi Germany.
* Racism arises from our need for self defense. We cannot defend ourselves as individuals, that’s basic, so we have to join a group. Then, by defending the group we defend ourselves.
But what group should we join? The problem is that of reciprocation. If we are going to join a group and risk our lives for it, other group members must also be willing to sacrifice for us or what’s the point?
But how can we know if others in the group will reciprocate? Well, to judge that we can only try to understand the mentality of others in our group, to know, in particular, how reliable they are or if they tend to be free riders.
Every member of a racial/family group expects others in the group to broadly think and act like himself. I broadly understand other North West European whites. They are generally kind of like me. So I am willing to take the chance of standing by them. A black, a Chinaman, or an Indian? By experience I know they are all free riders, see me as an outsider, and will never show loyalty to me or do their duty towards me.
So I must side with my closest racial relatives.
* White Nationalism is best and most reliable when it’s situational: like during Katrina when lower class White locals and Euro tourists all circled together at the Superdome. Let our idealism follow the notion that we’d better hang together or hang separately.
* Difference between racial nationalism and plain nationalism:
Racial nationalism – The state exists for the explicit benefit of a particular racial or ethnic group.
Plain nationalism – The state exists for the benefit of all of its citizens, but still takes steps to prevent its core ethnic group from becoming diluted or outnumbered, because it relies on that group to function well.
American nationalists should consider the old-school multi-ethnic empire model represented by Russia. A core ethnic group and various “confederated” minority groups that are subordinated to it. The United States actually has a similar relationship with its Native American population. I think one of the tragedies of US history is that the African-American model for race relations has dominated while the Native American model is all but forgotten.
* The problem with White Nationalism is that White people basically don’t care about being White. “People are people.” This is our tendency because of our genetic heritage, individualism borne of evolving with low population density, and relentless jewish propaganda that tamps down any possible racialist reaction even in the face of blatant genocide.
For White Nationalism to take off would require two things: 1) serious fucking economic pain. Like having to go hungry, not just being demoralized and 2) a religious awakening that has a racial component. Ben Klassen tried, but despite his well-thought-out arguments, it went precisely nowhere. You need 1 in order to have 2.
Look at Islam, especially in the early days– “I wish I could fight and die and be brought back again so I could fight and die and be brought back again, etc.” Vikings and Valhalla. Crusades Era Christianity. The Empire of Japan– Emperor worship and kamikazes. The Third Reich– Aryans, Blut und Boden, Blut und Ehre. (((judaism))).
Ideologies are weak. “Conservatism” is weak. Communism was weak; it lasted barely 70 years in Russia. Even White Nationalism is weak. The intellectual arguments of Dr. Pierce, Dr. Duke, and Dr. MacDonald don’t mean a thing to the vast majority of Whites. It’s sad and I hate it, but it’s true.
The White race needs a transcendental spiritual awakening of some kind.
* Wyndham Lewis wrote a travelogue of his time in America called “America and Cosmic Man” in which he observed how well the same people who were at each others’ throats in Europe got along in America, so it can be done.
* White nationalism is really just Germano-Celtic/Anglo-Celtic nationalism. I’m sure all the forms of government and culture most white nationalists would want would be Anglo in origin and most of those supporting it would be of Anglo-Celtic descent (Anglo-Celtic = British Isles) or if not Anglo Celtic than Germano-Celtic (think the northwestern part of europe.)
* Whatever the WN reflex becomes, I hope it’s something more enduring than what it replaces. as some of the commenters noted above, a spiritual foundation is essential. otherwise our lower human nature will ensure that whatever lives are spent in the pursuit of something better will inevitably be wasted, and the fruits of our labor will be taken for granted again by our children and grandchildren.
(Even if it’s all one giant cosmic folly, it still beats accepting your fate lying down and feeling like shit.)
* Yes, unfortunately, to be a Xtian these days in any mainline religion, one has to worship a Jew as their savior, and accept his message of weakness. The price of admission. Xtians in offshoot branches are only fooling themselves about the foundation of Xtianity.
* I can take that message out on a sit tonight and convert 15 soldiers for Christ…
Can you? Can any of you?
You children… you company men… you fairies.
* And what will you reward those soldiers with when they return home, after risking their lives in battle? a tatted up hypergamous slut and a house with a white picket barbed wire fence next to section 8 housing?
* Even soldiers for Christ expect their earthly rewards for doing their duty. how’s that supposed to work in the post-birth control world where sluttery is considered a woman’s birthright?
* First prize is a Cadillac… runner up gets a set of steak knives.
All seriousness aside, like all worthy endeavors in life, you do ’em ’cause it’s right… just right… and you have to look at yourself in the mirror each morning.
Rewards are a collateral occurrence… not a raison d’etre.
I can’t do much for a man whose only outlook is what happens in matters material.
Further, if the outlook is as bleak as you describe, then what philosophy, belief, or goal would ANYONE have for carrying on… let alone keep waging the good fight?
* For those of us of strong moral fiber, doing what’s right is reward in itself. I’m just not sure you can build an army of 18-20 year olds with that carrot.
I don’t think you could find 15 good, pretty, m@rriage worthy girls in this entire country, which means your soldiers for Christ will either have to share or fight each other for the meager spoils.
* White conservative instincts include the five moral spheres and Jacksonian code of honor. And white girls are magic and so motivating, but also of the Earth and do not belong on pedestals. And Christianity built Western Civ, since by definition what we have now was made by winners, like the Crusaders. Deus vult!
* Jared Taylor suggests approaching such a policy from an environmental viewpoint, as the environmentalists are constantly haranguing about overpopulation anyway. How is adding more and more population going to help our environment in North America?
It’s time for a Convergence, this time by the Alt-Right into the environmental movement, just like the SJWs took over science fiction publishing. What goes around, comes around.
Aborting immigration is a treehugger’s right!
* Environmental protection shows how disjointed the brains of liberals are. On the one hand many (rightfully so, as do many right-wing conservatives) want to protect the environment, including endangered species. At the same time, the Left (and not us right-wing conservatives) have no problem sending money and aid (including insane christard missionaries) to Africa and other third world nations that result in their birth rates going up, and death rates going down, resulting in incredible death and destruction of the environment and animal species. Such is the disjointed working of the liberal mind!
* The enemy is willing to die because he thinks God is on his side…
You’re going to fight that with tree-hugging and a mjolner pendant around your neck?
You guys think Christ is immaterial, then choose this day who or what you would worship…
… as for me and my house, we will serve Jehovah.
Get wise, and read up on how He delivers His (and your) enemies under your foot. We conquered peoples and continents in the name of Christ, and became the envy of the world.
Now that we’ve driven Him from the schools, the town squares, and indeed, our very national fabric, well… how’s THAT going for ya?
* There’s an interesting little war of innuendo going on via Jimmie Kimmel between Hillary and Alex Jones. Jimmie shot a pickle jar and said the NWO was out for AJ in a comedy skit. This is how they warn you. Alex just told Hillary she could still save her soul if she repents. Its classic trolling. Alex must have good security. That one ex SF man he hired is probably their Team Chief.
* “Likewise, a White Nationalism movement will fail.”
It’s a mistake to assess the prospects by looking backward, though (in history).
Does the average Scotsman today consider himself more Scottish, or more MacDougall, MacDonald, Campbell? (and what did they do to each other when the answer was ‘MacDougall, MacDonald, or Campbell’?)
Does a German feel more German, or Bavarian, Prussian, or Saxon? Chinese or Fujianese, Cantonese, Manchu? Does the average African American have any idea which of the mulltitude of West African tribes his ancestors were pulled out of?
(or for that matter, does a Jew feel more Jewish, or Ashkenazi, Sephardi, Mizrahi? (a weaker example)).
Of course, the answer in most cases is some of both, but which is dominant, and why?.
The driving forces here are not really even under our conscious control. They’re basically twofold: the fact that natural selection acts on the individual, not the group (sorry, but true), and the equally true condition that we’re fundamentally wired to form groups in which to compete with each other (to maximize the chances our ‘selfish genes’ will propagate). There’s no contradiction between the two.
We group up (and will ultimately do virtually anything to the ‘out-group’ for victory) because it improves our chances vs going it alone.
But, undeniably, the boundaries between ‘us’ vs ‘them’ have been pretty fluid, historically. The common denominator seems to be – smaller than whatever is ‘the whole’. Because if our group is ‘the whole’, while victory is assured, it’s over-assured, and our share of the spoils is diluted more than it needs to be. Too small, of course, and we may lose.
It runs in both directions. When our perception of ‘the whole’ expands, so do the boundaries of what we consider our group (eventually). We unite, and convince ourselves that we’re Scottish nationalists (vs those nasty English). And when it contracts, we break apart into squabbling, even warring, factions.
Such as we see happening before our eyes in America. The country truly is devolving into increasingly bitter, mutually antagonistic teams. It’s a re-drawing downward of the boundaries of ‘in’ vs ‘out’ group, and it was a natural, even inevitable outcome of America emerging undisputed world champion – from the Cold War, the ‘Japan-as-number-1’ bubble, etc.
No serious rivals, culturally, militarily, economically = ‘look out below’.
This is what SWPLs are really doing, by the way. Their seemingly ridiculous posturing is simply the proximate means (of shrinking the in-group). But it doesn’t matter what the means are. They’re not wrong. They’re not ‘stupid, self-hating, or pathologically altruistic (sorry, but true). They’re just pushing you out of the dominant in-group, to maximise the spoils.
The same dynamic is everywhere, at all levels of human groups. In families (Isolate a large family and watch them factionalise, squabble, even worse. Attack from the outside, and they close ranks). In politics (Labour trounces Conservatives = Labour splits apart. Blair and Brown couldn’t be in the same room together in the end.)
History is full of this process. History is a (very dynamic) optimization process.
So, serious white nationalism in America (in large numbers) will come when and only when the selfish, individual prospects for most whites clearly suffer for being white. (Obviously, we’re moving in that direction, but it’s early days).
If it continues, the response will be literally inevitable. And if it doesn’t, all but impossible.
And American nationalism and national cohesion will return when and only when Americans perceive a clear and pressing threat ‘from without’.
China? Muslims? (Or for that matter, AI and robots)?
If that doesn’t come, though – look out below!
* National Socialism is not the same as Soviet Socialism. Eugenics is built into the system. Dysgenic unions are discouraged and the natural hierarchy of Natural Selection is applied to Man. Man may not be just an animal, but breeding works for horses and dogs, and there is no reason such breeding cannot lead to better Men. Ubermensch is the goal of Fascism. That sad sack charity nonsense that breed the Untermensch and lead to Idiocracy must be outlawed and crushed. Sentimentality is for women or girly men. Fascists have hearts but believe in Tough Love. We want our sons to be Men. We want them to succeed and thrive and make us proud. To wear wings on their chests and Triumph through Their Will. One Nation, One People, One Leader. Western Civilization was not built by Capitalism, It Was Built on Industry. Henry Ford, Nicola Tesla, Thomas Edison: yes. Greed is good: NO, HELL NO!