Steve Sailer writes: “The path to mutual respect is to insist upon reciprocity. The most reasonable bargain would be for conservatives to demand of neoconservatives that in return for American support for Zionism, Zionists must publicly support America deploying the same immigration policies as Israel currently enjoys.”
Comments:
* A sensible suggestion, though ignoring the foreign policy costs the US pays for its support of Israel, including the ways it entangles the US in foreign wars and rivalries.
Interesting to note however the currently fourth newest comment beneath the article, from someone apparently subsequently removed (“guest”) by either Taki’s or by Disqus:
“So, apparently, linking to this typically informative piece by Mr. Sailer has gotten me banned from NRO and all my previous comments removed, down the Stalinist photoshop memory hole.”
As I’ve noted before, we face an onslaught against dissident opinion on all the fronts of “political correctness”, but the suppression of opinion seen as unpalatable by jewish nationalists and identity lobbyists seems to be the most ferociously and efficiently policed aspect of the assault on liberty. Something another of Sailer’s recent pieces touched upon:
Will Trump be Good for the Jewish People
* In my experience there’s almost nothing I can say about Israel, or even about Jews, that will not result in some nut, or crook, accusing me of anti-semitism. So I’m saying nowt.
* “It’s not my country.”
But in the US, esp if one is conservative, one gets nowhere without loving Israel more than one’s own country.
Just a reality.
So, it’s not a matter of passion for Israel. It’s about passion for independence FROM Israel-First-ism, which has turned into a right-wing version of minority-first-ism.
‘Rightist’ Jews tell gentile conservatives, “you must love Israel more than the US.”
‘Leftist’ Jews tell gentile liberals, “you must love non-white minority more than white majority.”
So, even if one has no feelings about Israel itself, American Politics is impossible without impassioned(or enraged) reactions to relation between US and Israel even if one is indifferent to issues INSIDE Israel.
It’s like this. Suppose Taiwan Lobby is the most powerful in America. Suppose Taiwanese-Americans have dominant control of media, academia, finance, and etc.
Now, suppose most of us don’t care about Taiwan itself or its relations with China.
But the fact is we still need to pay a lot of attention to the Taiwan Factor since the ruling elites would be Taiwanese-Americans who use all means, fair and foul, to compel us to support their agenda. We have no choice.
The problem with Israel is we don’t have to a choice. We must feign ‘passion’ even if we don’t have it if we are to get anywhere in America. That is the problem.
We don’t have to care about Armenia or Nepal to make it in the US. But try to move up the ladder, esp in politics or media, if one is indifferent or esp hostile to Israel.
* This might have gotten the sequence of events backwards: America’s immigration hawks have had to win first. Then, maybe, they’re in place to offer something to the Zionists for their ongoing support.
It’s early to say, but it’s possible that trends are pushing Zionism more and more towards being a movement of the right, or, conversely, leaving little comfortable ideological room for left-wing Zionists. I expect Trump to be even more unabashedly pro-Israel and pro-Likud than even the Bush Administration, both out of personal inclinations (his son-in-law is an Orthodox Jew; his proposed ambassador to Israel is Orthodox and also a supporter of the settler movement; and I wouldn’t be surprised if Trump generally sees the Palestinians as a bunch of losers); as well as political convenience. Support for Israel scrambles the whole “Trump is a Nazi” meme and squeezes the majority of American Jews – who are liberal, Reform, often secular, but still try to be Zionist – into an uncomfortable position. Obama, of course, has helped this by selling Israel out, the first time an American President has ever done so, at the UN. Israel is turning more and more right wing itself.
Again, it’s early to say, but this might be a positive development. Scrambling the allegiances and personal loyalties of and causing discomfort to a group that would produce many of Trump’s biggest potential political foes (liberal American Jews) isn’t a bad thing. I personally don’t see and have never seen why the US needs to engage in the kabuki of playing some sort of “honest broker” for “peace,” as opposed to supporting an ally outright, or for that matter what claim, after seven unbroken decades of defeats, the Palestinians have to nationhood, other than being propped up by broader international power politics. (Does anyone today mourn Biafra?) The irony that the majority of American Jews would lose control over the American-Israeli relationship, the meaning of Zionism, and part of their own identity to an aggressive and identitarian minority would be an ironic and fractally-shaped phenomenon.
Then again, the last Republican President who played footsie with American and Israeli neocons caused a lot of trouble and ran his own Administration and party into a ditch.
* I presume this means support for immigration policies that promote the maintenance or re-establishment of the United States as a European- or Northern European-majority country, explicitly end birthright citizenship, and allow for the deportation of all illegal infiltrators.
* Obama did not “sell Israel out.” The United States owes Israel nothing.
* I’m sick of the Middle Eastern wars. Thousands of Americans dead and trillions of dollars gone, and for what? Elevated testosterone levels in the blood of a few neocons and flush bank accounts for a few oil barons? We can toss the Israelis materiel and money (and their relatives can chip in privately), but they’re not worth the bones of one Alabama grenadier.
* “…Israel doesn’t arouse strong passions in me…”
I want you to close your eyes and think of Golda Meir for 30 seconds.
* Gotta hand it to Obama: Stirring up crap with Israel might turn out to be a clever way of tripping up Trump.
If I had to identify the biggest fault lines in the Trump coalition, Israel would be near the top. On one hand, you’ve got Trumpers who view Israel as a friend, ally, and potential model for a responsible resurgence of nationalism; they merely seek to rein in the Bush-era neocon nuttery and avoid straying too far from narrowly-defined US interests.
On the other hand, you’ve got the Trumpers who think (((echoes))) are funny and see right-wing Israeli Zionism and left-wing Jewish subversion of Western culture as two sides of the same evil coin.
The good thing is that, as of right now, both sides seem to realize that they need the other, so they’re keeping a lid on internal disagreements.
Trump himself appears to fall into the first camp, but he’s conscious that he has a lot of supporters in the second camp, so he tries to avoid antagonizing them. I’m hoping he’ll continue that approach, but it might be hard, especially if the Left tries to intentionally stoke the flames. I’m hoping Trump and his supporters — and the Israelis, for that matter — won’t fall for this transparent “let’s you and him fight” gambit.
* Israelis should purse their interests and their security as they see fit. And America should stop being the co-signer on their mortgage.
* Israel’s built-in immigration policy is Right of Return, which is a variation of family reunification in a sense.
It’s also in a sense similar to the White Australia policy, which seems very sensible in practice, though I would never say that out loud. Did I just say that out loud?
I got into iSteve mainly on the immigration issue (and movies): Tie it to labor demand, and have it reflect the founding population. Unfortunately, possession and the law and that, the ‘changing demographics’ kind of ruined the second part.
‘Citizenism’ is where it’s at, and it really should be used by Trump and everyone else to describe the general philosophy of this new movement or whatever it is.
Leftists get very stroppy when you even differentiate between citizens and non, esp. here in NYC. But citizens don’t. That’s why we should use it.
* Obama doesn’t like Israel. Netanyahu did endorse Mitt Romney after all. So on his way out he declines to use his veto to protect them from some UN resolution. Kerry says then goes and says apartheid is bad. Netanyahu complains. Trump, hoping to gain some points with the (non-alt-)right and possibly get to see his grandkids more often, goes after Obama and claims he’ll be nicer to Israel, annoying the alt-right.
Now did Obama do this to split the non-alt-right and alt-right? Maybe. Most of Trump’s working class base doesn’t give a pork bottom one way or the other about Israel, but the elite left is always on Twitter and is hoping to see the /pol/ crowd turn on Trump. Doesn’t really seem to be working so far–everyone’s more worked up over Baked Alaska versus Cernovich from what I can see.
* As an American rightie, my view on the Jewish Question is pretty simple: I play by the rules as I have found them. Since the end of World War II, one of the ironclad rules has been: No antisemitic (or anti-Jewish, or anti-Zionist, or anti-Israel, or whatever you want to call it) person from the right will ever be allowed anywhere near the levers of power. Ever. Period. End of discussion.
Don’t like it? Thank good ol’ A.H.
As with all rules, this one will probably be modified, eventually — but probably not for, I’d say another 100 years, at least: Around 2116 or thereabouts. Long enough for World War II to seem as far in the past as the War of Austrian Succession is today.
Now the left is a different kettle of fish. If hating on Israel or whatever is a nonnegotiable issue for you, then your place in this day and age is on the left. On the left, you can stand around all day singing the Horst Wessel Lied and reading aloud excerpts from the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, but as long as you’re wearing a Che Guevara shirt and dreadlocks, and throw in a sprinkling of quotes from Marx and Jay-Z, then a jaw-droppingly huge chunk of the left will be willing to look the other way and make excuses for you. Not ALL of them will — but enough will. You’ll be protected.
If that’s your thing, then go out and live your dreams, man.
But shave your head and start flashing Nazi salutes, and the entire culture, Jewish and non-Jewish alike, will wheel its artillery around and unload on your coordinates. Nukes will be authorized. There will be no survivors.
Fine. I can live with that. Jewish malevolence towards gentiles is way, way, waaaaay down the list of my concerns. It’s not a nonissue for me, but it’s way, waaaaaay down there. I am a Woody Allen fan, for crying out loud. If enthusiasm for Jews and Israel is the price I have to pay to be a respectable right-winger, I’ll be happy to pay it … up to a point. I’m an American and will always place American interests first: That’s nonnegotiable for me. But if I have to say “yay, Israel! Yay, Bibi!” every now and then to get there … hey, whatever, man.
I suspect Donald Trump would agree. The only reason we GOT Trump is because he reliably spouts the bipartisan consensus on Israel.
Like I said: Fine. Whatever. I have more pressing issues. Yay, Israel. Are you happy now?
As Steve said: It’s not my country. Let me have a sane, responsible government for MY country, and then Israel can go do whatever the hell it wants, as long as they keep me out of it.
* Obama did this for his own ego, nothing to do with Trump. He despised Bibi from day one, and the enmity was similar to that between him and Putin, palpable and uncomfortable. Obama was never good at mixing with strong alpha males like Putin or Bibi, preferring to kid around and take selfies with Trudeau, Merkel or Turnbull in Australia.
Support for Israel is pretty much 89% among Trump supporters, 10% don’t give a toss, and 1% are strongly anti-Israel (e.g. Richard Spencer etc). Trump supporting Bibi and inviting him to the White House will show two alpha males in good company, in agreement, and both demonstrating strength and resolve to Arabs, the UN, and the EU. Liberal Jews will be forced to accept Trump will probably be the most pro-Israel President in history, and will probably be the most well-loved US politician in Israel (the amount of support for Trump among the right wing Israelis over there is already ‘yuge’).
Trump, however, is not so dumb as to kowtow to another world leader, especially a world leader who is very similar to him (there will be a male rivalry between Bibi and the Don, in a good natured way). Trump will ‘stand with Israel’ but I doubt he will permit the exorbitant foreign aid to continue. He also has an uncanny way of charismatically going againt the Israel/Neocon narrative. Look at Iraq and the Mid East more generally – during the primary debates he frequently denounced Bush and Co as ‘knowing’ that Saddam had no WMDs yet invaded anyway. He denounced the ‘stupid’ decisions made by past administrations in going into the Mid East and not winning anything, spending trillions and costing thousands of lives. This goes against the Yinon Plan, which has been a staple of Israeli foreign policy since the 70s and 80s (i.e. intervene in the Mid East to destabilise Arab nations and splinter them into ethnic factions. Iraq was specifically targeted by Yinon as a country to destabilise as soon as practicable). Trump’s foreign policy, ergo, is completely antithetical to Bibi’s or Likud’s. Trump won’t fold on that either, if there’s one thing he is dead-set consistent on is his anti-interventionism.
In other words, Trump will control Bibi and ‘manage’ him, like he did with Paul Ryan or the GOP Congressional leaders. Trump is a master manipulator and PR genius. He isn’t so stupid as to be made a fool of by another alpha male. It’s all psychological for him, and for this reason, I’m extremely confident he will use Israel to his – and America’s – advantage.
* I owe Israel nothing. Nada. I don’t care whether it collapses tomorrow or endures for a thousand years. I feel nothing for it (or against it).
To me, Israel is little more than a vacuum cleaner sucking money out of the U.S. Treasury. If it weren’t for Mideast oil, I’d stand back and watch the Jews and the Arabs slaughter each other to their hearts’ content.
In that fight, I’d root for the Jews, if only because Islam is such a fearsome enemy. I might even bankroll them, but not to the extent that we’re bankrolling them now.
As an American, I seek to benefit myself and my country. Any benefits that might accrue to other countries through my actions are purely incidental. If other countries prosper as America jockeys for world leadership, wonderful; if not, too bad.
Something tells me that the Israelis don’t sit around agonizing over whether they’re getting an unfair amount of aid from Uncle Sam. “Oy, how can we ever repay the Americans for all they’ve done for us? We’re in their eternal debt!”
I don’t begrudge any man his single-minded devotion toward making his land and his kind reign supreme above all others. Jews, American or otherwise, are perfectly within their rights to try to convince me that I should give a hoot whether their supposed homeland withers or thrives. I’m perfectly within my rights to tell them that I don’t care one way or the other.
Of course, the sad truth is that many of my fellow goys are dumb and/or naive enough to swallow the BS: “Israel must get everything it wants, and more!” If I weren’t a free-speech absolutist, I would say that the neocons’ views should be censored to protect the feeble-minded. But I do honestly believe that, in the end, the downsides of too much freedom of expression are far more tolerable than those of too little.
* Steve Sailer: “Adelson’s behavior in 2016 was admirable.”
