I call F. Roger Devlin at noon Friday, August 28, 2015, to discuss his new book (MP3. (Update: My June 21, 2021 interview is here.)
Here is a partial transcript of my interview today:
Roger: “I’ve discovered an age gap in the response to my work. Older man think I am a bitter misogynist. Younger men say I explain precisely what they have seen all their lives and haven’t been able to account for.”
“The old ways of getting a girl just don’t work any more.”
Luke: “I would contend that a million people could have read the websites you did and not have written this book. How were you able to take what you read online and distill it as you did?”
Roger: “I do have a background in philosophy. I am used to analyzing arguments and data. As I studied this stuff, a whole new model of sexual dynamics began forming itself in my mind. When I was growing up, I had this idea that the man had to prove his worthiness to the girl. It was a very romantic chivalrous view of the sexes.”
Luke: “When did you first start publishing in the dissident right?”
Roger: “In 2004. My first article was on Victor Davis Hanson.”
“I discovered Chronicles magazine in 1997 and Sam Francis quickly became my favorite author there.”
“I didn’t have a particularly successful academic career [graduating with a PhD in Political Philosophy from Tulane in 1996]… One of the few things I can do well is write. I started writing essays [in 2004] and sending them in and eventually it became my full-time job. I have no other job now other than working for the dissident right, publishing essays and doing a lot of work behind the scenes. I do quite a bit of editing and translating.”
Luke: “Did you understand the implications this would have for your life when you began publishing in 2004 for The Occidental Quarterly?”
Roger: “Not really… I was ready to take a break. I’m psychologically suited for playing the role of pariah. I don’t care about getting invited to D.C. cocktail parties. On the other hand, I couldn’t do this work if I had a large family to support.”
Luke: “I was raised to have a horror of hitting a woman. I never saw my dad hit my mom. Then I was bewildered by dating and relationships because I’ve had a number of women smack me.”
Roger: “I had an experience like that in elementary school. There was a girl classmate of mine who had heard it said that boys were not supposed to hit girls and she inferred from this that it was ok for her to hit boys and they shouldn’t retaliate. She went around doing this and had to learn her lesson the hard way. That is a problem with the feminist movement. A lot of women are taught that they can behave any way they want.”
Luke: “I’ve had this confusing situation where to placate an angry woman, I’ve opened up and shared something vulnerable. At the time, it often does take their anger away so we can get intimate, but in the long run, it fuels their contempt for me.”
Roger: “It is dangerous to reveal weaknesses to women. Women want strong men. This is one reason why men don’t talk about their vulnerabilities. Men have to appear strong, even if they are feeling weak.”
“The traditional program for getting sex out of the way is marriage.”
Friend: “I would ask him if it is possible to have an ethical and moral society without religion, and then assuming religion is necessary for a moral and ethical society, how pluralistic can the religions be.”
Roger: “There is some evidence both ways.”
“Victorianism reduced the illegitimacy rate below 1% and this was not accompanied by any great religious revival. Something can be done just on the social level. Religion holds much of its effect on its hold on social mores, not so much theological belief. Religion affects people’s behavior by sanctioning punishments for adultery, etc. Almost all women believe in God but they still behave very badly because there are no social sanctions against bad female behavior.”
Luke: “I can’t think of many examples of when Jewish strength and white strength weren’t contradictory in a society.”
Roger: “Yes. The issue comes down to the inevitable problems that arise from sharing territory. Tatu Vanhanen demonstrated that ethnic conflict is universal. You always have problems when you have different kinds of people trying to share territory, particularly when you have people such as Europeans who have such a different mentality from Jews.”
“Culture is geographically bound and has a natural principle of exclusion of that which is not compatible with itself. Because of the tendency of human beings to create a tribal culture, you are going to have problems when you have different peoples trying to share territory. I’m a universal nationalist. I want Jews to have their own territory, our people to have their own territory.”
“Partly the problems we have with our Jews are our own fault. Partly they occur because we have lost confidence in our down dominant culture and refuse to enforce it anymore.”
Luke: “Do you think the decline of the West over the past 50 years is primarily the result of these radical left-wing Jewish movements or is it primarily the result of white weakness?”
Roger: “Impossible to say. It’s a chicken and egg problem.”
Luke: “How should one with your views respond to slurs?”
Roger: “I’m not particularly high profile, so I haven’t been much publicly attacked. I guess the best way to do it is to be dignified, emphasize that you are on the side of human nature and all of history supports your views and some people will eventually be won over. State your position forthrightly and let the chips fall where they may.”
Luke: “Are you a Christian?”
Roger: “No, I’m not a religious person, but essentially my book is a defense of the Christian idea of marriage on rational and experience based argument.”
