Do you think the US has a national interest in Israel in proportion to our aid and involvement with Israel? If not, why do you think the USA is so involved in Israel? Do you think it is the Israel lobby and we should discuss this sort of thing publicly? I am a convert to Judaism and Israel to me is as important as God and Torah. I am greatly concerned with Israel’s well-being (as I am with America’s, sometimes I am more concerned about one than the other, it varies, just as my relations with friends and family varies). I’m just wondering why Israel should be so important to Americans who are not Jewish?
A fellow convert tells me:
I don’t really think it’s a scam. I think the goyim concerned with Israel are for the most part evangelicals who, in a sense, believe they’re scamming us since they’re concern is motivated by end days scenarios. Don’t you think? Now, the question of the US’s political involvement is an interesting one. I think, though, that it’s due not really to Jewish lobbying but to evangelical influence combined with Jewish lobbying.
I don’t think Americans who aren’t Jewish or religiously Christian care about Israel. I really don’t. Or, if they did care, they are caring less and less these days.
I just remember my upbringing–we were evangelicals who were obsessed with Israel and even Jews to a certain degree. I remember when I was seven years old or something like that–the news was on and I heard one of my parents say something about how the day America does not stand with Israel is the day we will be destroyed. And I’ve heard these sentiments in Christian communities. It’s weird, but, we’ll take it, right?
Jim* says: “Michael Oren is a brilliant man, who understands the United States well, and served Israel well as Ambassador here. However, he is building a case to justify the relationship; any objectivity is a pretense. The Pollard case is a good example. The Israelis had no problem stealing the most important classified information and then trading it to the Soviets when it served Israel’s interest. Or you can see how the Israelis are suspected of selling a Lavi prototype to China with advanced American avionics. Oren doesn’t mention these incidents.”
Jeff* says: “What politician’s fear most is losing elections. What put that fear into American politicians more than anything was the defeat of Republican Illinois Senator Charles Percy in 1984. At the time, it was reported that Michael Goland, donated huge sums to Paul Simon to help him defeat Percy. Other Congressman, including Illinois representative, Paul Findley (later the author of a book, “They dare to speak out,” about how the Israel Lobby would target opponents of Israel) and San Mateo Congressman Paul “Pete” McCloskey were tarred as anti-semites because of their criticism of Israeli policies. Cynthia McKinney of Georgia, although a nut, was singled out by AIPAC because of her positions on Israel. Basically any politician who speaks out against Israeli policy, or shows sympathy (other than lip service) to Palestinians draws the wrath of AIPAC, Saban, Adelson, or any number of wealthy Jews who either individually or through their PACS will try to defeat them. Since for most politicians, opposing Israel is not something their constituents care one way or another about, even if on principle they oppose either specific Israeli policies, or U.S. government policies toward Israel they would rather stay in office and not make this the defining issue that might cost them their seats.”
Wow, what an inspiring story! Who says one man can’t make a difference? Sometimes the ends do justify the means. Jews are smart people, no SDA would be this canny.
“He is probably the most influential contributor that no one has heard of. His impact is felt to this day. I don’t doubt that AIPAC used his tactics to their advantage in subsequent races.”
Jack* says:
I actually don’t see how U.S. relationship with Israel serves America’s interests at all, and don’t see how it has since the Cold War ended. And now that the US will soon exceed Saudi Arabia in oil production, one more of the old arguments for the relationship (Israel is America’s “battleship” in the Middle East, protecting our oil supply) is DOA. I have a strong attachment to Israel and would probably not want to live on in a world in which Israel’s existence had been ended militarily, but that doesn’t help me gin up any objective reason why non-Jewish Americans are obligated to give a damn.
A lot of them do, though. I don’t know if you’ve had a lot of experience with American evangelical Christian zeal for Israel, but it’s intense, widespread, and as a phenomenon can’t be explained by Jewish influence in the press, academia or other American institutions. It’s genuinely a Christian thing, even if Jews had wanted to make it happen they couldn’t have conceived of it. So I’d say that at this point the relationship between US and Israel is function of both Jewish influence and Evangelical Christian influence on American political life. Not exactly a scam on the goyim, but also not an expression of any general American interest.
